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Sadik in the Sewers

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Deckard Solo

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Post Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:39 pm

Sadik in the Sewers

Hi guys!

After Guzza dies during the sewer confrontation, Sadik makes a mad dash from the lower right to the bottom of the screen. I've tried shooting him while he's exposed, but I just can't seem to kill him. I've tried sneaky tactics like blocking Sadik's path with McCoy to make him waste time sidestepping. Even then, I can't land a single shot. Now, at the Moonbus, Sadik can be stun-locked if you fire really fast, but here he doesn't seem to have a "getting hit" animation at all.

Has anyone managed to kill Sadik during this encounter?

I ask, because in Westwood's Secrets article, they mention that during this sequence, "We will allow [McCoy] to return fire, and if he's really good, he can retire Sadik."

Do you think Sadik is flagged as invulnerable here? It's not impossible; maybe Westwood had to scrap any ending(s) that acknowledges Sadik's early death due to time constraints. Plus, we know that plenty of things didn't make it into the game. For example: all the unused voiceovers, or the ability to arrest Crazy Legs Larry (which cannot be done AFAIK but is mentioned in that article.) Maybe making Sadik invincible was a quick hack to simplify the ending variables a bit.

The only argument against this is that Sadik can be killed at the Bradbury (with a lot of luck), leading to a dead end for the player. For that reason, it seems "hard coded" invulnerability is contrary to the design of the game. Do you think this is an exception or not?

Cheers!
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Gene Ettix

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Post Tue Apr 29, 2008 1:46 pm

Well, Sadik can (and must) be killed at the Junkyard out in the Kipple in some versions.
No dead-end for the player, either.
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BR796164

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Post Wed Apr 30, 2008 1:42 am

IF the player really can retire him in the sewers, it must be very very difficult,
and oh, I wasted a lot of time trying... But from narrative standpoint it's better to wait for confrontation in the kipple.
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Deckard Solo

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Post Sat May 03, 2008 11:56 pm

Well, after another two dozen tries or so, I'm pretty sure it can't be done. I'm also pretty sure that when the Moonbus is full of replicants, you can't pull your gun and kill everyone without being shot down first. Just like how Clovis can't be killed when he grabs McCoy in the sewers, and you can't shoot down Early Q without getting blasted by Hanoi. The ability to kill Sadik at the Bradbury is just a designer oversight, it seems.

Thus, the game has its share of invisible rails. Not that it's really that big of a deal. Even if certain actions are forcefully prohibited, the designers did a very good job of preserving the illusion of freedom. Most adventure games these days can't even be bothered to maintain an illusion, let alone go for real freedom.

So yeah, after playing enough to see almost every ending, I've gotta say that Blade Runner really is one of the most remarkable adventure games of the last 10 years. Even compared to games of *all* genres, it still stands pretty tall IMHO.

Anyway, I hope whoever reads this thread at least finds something interesting to think about!
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BR796164

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Post Mon May 05, 2008 3:43 am

I still dream somebody sometimes would make a new BR game similar to Deus Ex or Fallout... sigh.
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Horoma

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Post Mon May 05, 2008 6:15 am

I think the scene with Clovis in the sewers is the only occassion where it's made technically impossible to shoot your target. Sadik at the Bradbury, Sadik in the sewers, Izo outside Bullet Bob's are all occassions where you technically have the possibility to kill them, but they made it so damn hard that a human player couldn't possibly do so. The difficulty has 3 causes :
- the victim is running
- the victim appears only a brief moment on screen (before Crystal appears in the case of Izo)
- the victim is moving in a diagonal direction
Only with Sadik in the Bradbury they overestimated the difficulty because he's running vertically.

As Deckard Solo indicates, this gives the player at least the illusion of being in control.
"Yeah, I’ve seen the data. Implanted memories and four year life span. I’d probably get a little crazy too, but I wouldn’t start killing people."
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BR1661

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Post Sat May 24, 2008 9:29 am

Deckard Solo wrote:Well, after another two dozen tries or so, I'm pretty sure it can't be done. I'm also pretty sure that when the Moonbus is full of replicants, you can't pull your gun and kill everyone without being shot down first.


Dude, it's so possible to kill all the reps in the moonbus..freakin' hard but possible. You just really have to plan your shots well.

The main problem is the shooting action somtimes gets confused with the talking action and McCoy starts babbling when your trying to retire them.

I forget what happens when you retire them all..but im i think you get one of the lonely endings...
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sadik

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Post Sun Jun 01, 2008 8:59 am

i second that: deus ex +br just perfect...absolute freedom
cant u see it, man?...it is a machine just like u!!
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Horoma

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Post Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:41 am

BR1661 wrote:Dude, it's so possible to kill all the reps in the moonbus..freakin' hard but possible. You just really have to plan your shots well.

The main problem is the shooting action somtimes gets confused with the talking action and McCoy starts babbling when your trying to retire them.

I forget what happens when you retire them all..but im i think you get one of the lonely endings...


I'm not saying you're being dishonnest, but I admit I find that hard to believe as well. I know I tried it numerous times in a game where I had all reps in the moonbus (Clovis, Sadik, Zuben, Izo, Gordo & Dektora). As soon as I drew my gun, no matter from which corner, I got shot before I could even get a single shot out myself. I can imagine it's quite possible in a game with less remaining reps, but do you really mean you were able to shoot all 6 of them in such a tight space, before getting shot yourself ? :-k
"Yeah, I’ve seen the data. Implanted memories and four year life span. I’d probably get a little crazy too, but I wouldn’t start killing people."

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